date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:33:24 +0000 from: Phil Jones subject: Fwd: RE: Rewriting History to: c.goodess@uea.ac.uk,k.briffa@uea.ac.uk,m.kelly@uea.ac.uk, d.viner@uea.ac.uk,t.osborn@uea.ac.uk,t.holt@uea.ac.uk Dear All, Including you all on some recent email traffic that clearly states Mike's views about Tyndall and where we all fit in as part of Tyndall. We are no longer part of ENV but part of Tyndall it seems ! This almost certainly won't be the last word and I might regret initiating all this this morning but it useful to have it in an email. Cheers Phil >Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:29:04 +0000 >To: f037 , "m.hulme" , "t.d.davies" > >From: Phil Jones >Subject: RE: Rewriting History >Cc: "j.palutikof" , r.k.turner@uea.ac.uk > > > Mike, > Thanks for the email and the views of how Tyndall fits in within UEA > and more widely > within the UK. It shows how vital a document that illustrates how all > the parts of ENV > fit together is needed, particularly with ZICER coming along (hence the > addition of Kerry > to this email). In your view ZICER is also part of Tyndall, but I > suspect that is not how the > majority in ENV and certainly in CRU feel. I am reminded of the > discussion we had at the > away day about who we were batting for. We all need to know where we fit > in. I don't regard > CRU as part of Tyndall, because I regard Tyndall as a part of ENV. It is > not that I no longer > wish CRU to be a part, it is all a matter of perception. I realise that > you have many > constituencies within the Tyndall consortium, but it is ENV that is > housing you and paying > the taxes. > As for CRU's research funding from Tyndall I thought we got these > because Jean and I > were part of the bid, but more importantly because we put some good > proposals together. > As for the EoIs, it would be equally helpful if we had known what > EoIs Tyndall had been > involved in. We are involved in several, although a small number of > these have probably > fallen by the wayside. Barely a day goes by without an email or a call > about FP6 and there > just isn't enough time in the day to keep everyone informed of all > developments. We are all > at the mercy of the EU, with their unwritten agenda of how FP6 will > develop. We have a > document dated 10/10/02 which is much nearer the present version than > the one Janice has > recently circulated, hence my recent email to all of ENV. The EU will > regard us all (including > Tyndall) as UEA in any submission. > > Until we have the ZICER document I don't think a meeting will be > beneficial. I suspect that > such a document, which we all clearly need, will be more difficult to > write than a Nature > paper. > > Phil > > >At 11:41 30/10/02 +0000, f037 wrote: >>Phil, >> >>It seems most regretable that you continue to take such a negative >>attitude to >>most things that Tyndall seems to be trying to do. To answer your specific >>criticisms: >> >>- the short blurb of wording in the event flyer indeed draws attention to >>the >>two pioneering IAMs on climate change in Europe to demonstrate the >>pedigree of >>the organisations putting the event together; ESCAPE was indeed co-ordinated >>by CRU with input from RIVM and ECI and I was deeply involved with Tom and >>Dick and many others in the work. However, CRU and ENV are an integral part >>of the Tyndall Centre and in my view of the world I take that as written, >>just >>as are UMIST, SPRU, ITS, etc. This is why CRU has received over £300,000 of >>research funding from the Tyndall Centre. [By the way, this collegiate >>spirit >>is also why John Schellnhuber and I shared with colleagues in ENV and CRU a >>very early sight of the "non-paper" describing the Work Programme for >>1.1.6.3 >>and invited suggestions to allow John to feed these back into the Commission >>to help our (collective) cause]. Would you suggest that in a short event >>flyer I mention every individual constituent part of Tyndall Centre? How >>about all the other organisations in Europe that were part of our EoI to the >>EU that we practically could not mention in such a document? Or do you no >>longer wish us to regard the CRU as a core partner in Tyndall? >> >>- the Tyndall Centre is not synonymous with UEA, although it is >>headquartered >>here, which is why I sometimes, when appropriate as on this occasion, use >>the >>Tyndall Centre w/o a UEA label. For your interest, I have been criticised >>from other Tyndall partners on occasions for implying in public that Tyndall >>and UEA are one. I have learned to tread carefully on this issues. >> >>- this event in Brussels was, I believe, announced in In Tyndall as >>something >>that Tyndall Centre had submitted and which the Commission had >>short-listed. >>If it was not (I cannot check from home), then I accept this was an >>oversight >>on my part. My apologies. We only knew we had been awarded the >>side-event in >>the 1st week October anyway. [If I wanted to respond in kind, I might ask >>would it not have been helpful for Tyndall Centre to be made aware of the >>various EoIs that CRU submitted to the Commission that related to work >>Tyndall >>Centre is trying to promote?] >> >>- the Earth System Science element of this event is represented by the >>ENES/PRISM network, which also put an EoI into the commission (as well as >>one >>or more IPs) but which did *not* bid for a side-event. In non-trivial and >>extensive discussions over a period of several weeks between our enVISAge >>partners and ENES representatives we (I) have very carefully held a >>balance of >>interests in Europe together to enable us to present a joint and coherent >>front to the Commission about how these two research communities in Europe >>plan to work together. It should be pointed out that Guy Brasseur has been >>heading the ENES initiatives and that John Schellnhuber is, at least to my >>knowledge, an equally ardent supporter of Earth System Science - which is >>perhaps why Andy and John have both been asked by NERC to sit on the QUEST >>steering committee. >> >>- as to the diplomatic and scientific and organisational effort that has >>gone >>into making this event happen during the launch conference, I will not bore >>you with, but I find it very dispiriting that our efforts are met with >>appreciation across the UK and Europe and yet one of my close colleagues >>here >>at UEA seems to be more concerned with finding fault and undermining what we >>believe is an initiative that will bring significant benefits to the >>School of >>Environmental Sciences and to UEA. >> >>Please feel free to share these sentiments with your colleagues. Equally, I >>repeat my offer to come over and visit CRU - Board or Forum or individuals - >>in order to share my view of how (and why) Tyndall Centre is operating. >> >>Mike >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >===== Original Message From Phil Jones ===== >> >> Trevor and Mike, >> > I have talked to you both in the past month or two about how >> >most people in CRU think >> > CRU is being ignored by Tyndall and ENV. In the attachment there is the >> >sentence. >> > >> > The group also includes the pioneers of most of the European developments >> >in integrated >> > modelling of climate change to date, starting with the IMAGE and ESCAPE >> >models in the >> > early 1990s: a consortium from the Netherlands, including RIVM, IVM, >> >ICIS; the Tyndall >> > Centre for Climate Change Research; CIRED in Paris; and PIK in Germany. >> > >> > There is no mention of UK or UEA. As I recall, ESCAPE was developed in >> >CRU and also >> > incorporated the MAGICC software that Tom and Sarah were heavily involved >> >with. Tyndall >> > didn't exist when ESCAPE was written. Tell me how I am not supposed to >> >take away from this >> > sentence anything other than Tyndall attempting to rewrite history ! >> > >> > ENV is large and we all have agendas that involve more hours than there >> >are in the day. Even >> > if we haven't time to get together much, we need to consider the other >> >parts when putting >> > together documents. >> > >> > Phil >> > >> > PS It would have been nice to have been informed about this event, but I >> >don't feel too bad as I >> > suspect others in ENV (such as Andy Watson, who has been championing >> >Earth System >> > Modelling work) were similarly ignored. >> > >> > >> > >> >Prof. Phil Jones >> >Climatic Research Unit Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090 >> >School of Environmental Sciences Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784 >> >University of East Anglia >> >Norwich Email p.jones@uea.ac.uk >> >NR4 7TJ >> >UK >> >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> ---- > >Prof. Phil Jones >Climatic Research Unit Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090 >School of Environmental Sciences Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784 >University of East Anglia >Norwich Email p.jones@uea.ac.uk >NR4 7TJ >UK >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Prof. Phil Jones Climatic Research Unit Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090 School of Environmental Sciences Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784 University of East Anglia Norwich Email p.jones@uea.ac.uk NR4 7TJ UK ----------------------------------------------------------------------------