date: Fri Feb 4 16:51:39 2005
from: Phil Jones
subject: Re: A few comments
to: "Richard Gyllencreutz" , dhebbeln@uni-bremen.de
Dear Dierk and Richard,
I still have not found any quality time to look at the draft. I also now have the
Iberian paper which arrived a couple of days ago. Both hard copies are in my bag
for the flight to Madrid on Sunday and also on my laptop. So, I hope to get to
them both - your one first though !
A few thoughts though on the current email. I would echo the points about using
calendar dates. You have done well to put AD before the date. The Iberians have it
after everywhere ! If you can I would omit reference to the MWP and LIA. The jury
is still out (and will likely never come to a verdict) on whether the periods existed
or how long they were if they did. If you want to say something the 10th and 11th
centuries were likely the warmest of the last 3000 years (up to and including the
19th century). The coldest two centuries were the 17th and 19th for the last 2000
years. The 6th may also have been as cold, but there is much less evidence.
I will at least get to the introduction and discussion/conclusions.
Cheers
Phil
At 15:47 04/02/2005, Richard Gyllencreutz wrote:
Dear Dierk (and Phil),
I hope you received my revised version of the manuscript. I forgot to mention my
revision of the last sentences of the abstract, which I hope is a more efficient
wording. I have some further comments:
On page 10 (I think it would be good to insert page numbers before submitting), I think
its better to use the word "documented" instead of "reported", and to use appriximate
ages instead of the terms LIA and MWP. See the new suggested text versions 1 and 2
below.
1) Higher Atlantic sea surface temperatures has been documented in several cores from
the Norwegian margin from ca AD 1200 to AD 1400-1450 (Koç and Jansen, 2002;
Risebrobakken et al., 2003; Andersson et al., 2003) and from fjords in western Norway
from ca AD 1300-1350 to AD 1550-1600 (Mikalsen, 2001; Klitgaard Kristensen et al.,
2004).
2) This is supported by data from Björck and Clemmensen (2004), where aeolian sand
influx in raised bogs in southwestern Sweden indicate increased winter storminess from
ca AD 1450 to AD 1900, preceded by about 700 years of low values.
Another, more problematic point (Here I especially address Phil):
After reading Hughes and Diaz (1994, Climatic Change 26 "Was there a MWP, and if so,
where and when?"), I am not really convinced about the sentence
"While the MWP is often seen as the warmest period since the Holocene climatic optimum
(Reference?), the LIA is referred to as the coldest period since the Younger Dryas
(Folland et al., 1990)."
The IPCC volume (Houghton et al., 1990) which includes the Folland reference above, was
criticised due to inadequate data regarding the MWP by Hughes and Diaz (1994, p.136).
However, according to Hughes and Diaz (1994), it seems safe to assume that the medieval
warm period was warmer than the following 600 years. Crowley and Lowery (2000, Ambio 29)
writes: "To conclude, a new compilation of evidence for Medieval warmth indicates 3
relatively short-lived warming intervals (10101040, 10701105, and 11551190) that are
comparable to the mid-20th century warm period. Scaling of the hemispheric composite to
the Northern Hemisphere temperature records suggests that Little Ice Age temperatures
were about 0.450.50°C colder than the mid-20th century warm period and that mean
temperatures between 10001200 were only about 0.20°C warmer than the Little Ice Age."
Since it seems hard to find any reference supporting the statement above, I think we
should express our opinion a bit more cautious, but I don't know how. What do you think?
What does Phil Jones say about this? Maybe we should just wrap it and leave it for the
referees?
cheers
Richard
At 10:49 2005-02-03, you wrote:
Dear all,
thanks to Dorthe for realising that the final version of our
HOLSMEER paper sent around yesterday was not the real final but
an older version. Sorry, obviously there are too many folders and
files on my computer. Please, find NOW attached the final version
for a last check.
Cheers,
Dierk
**********************************************************
Dr. Dierk Hebbeln Tel. +49-421-2189079
FB Geowissenschaften Fax +49-421-2189080
Universität Bremen dhebbeln@uni-bremen.de
Postfach 330440
D-28334 Bremen
Germany
The following section of this message contains a file attachment
prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format.
If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system,
you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer.
If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance.
---- File information -----------
[1]File: Northern Coastal Sites HOLSMEER paper.doc
Date: 2 Feb 2005, 16:38
Size: 2354688 bytes.
Type: Unknown
___________________________________
Richard Gyllencreutz
Department of Geology and Geochemistry
Stockholm University
SE-10691 Stockholm
Sweden
Ph:+46-8-674 77 25
Fax: +46-8-674 78 97
richard.gyllencreutz@geo.su.se
___________________________________
Med en geolog, man menar, en, vars levebröd är stenar
Prof. Phil Jones
Climatic Research Unit Telephone +44 (0) 1603 592090
School of Environmental Sciences Fax +44 (0) 1603 507784
University of East Anglia
Norwich Email p.jones@uea.ac.uk
NR4 7TJ
UK
----------------------------------------------------------------------------